Resolved Hans Godder PK Appeal 2

Discussion in 'Accepted/Denied Appeals' started by Silanus, Mar 25, 2020.

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  1. Silanus

    Silanus Happy Person
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    Steam Name: Silanus
    Steam ID: STEAM_0:1:87273099
    Server: Stasiland
    Character Name: Hans Godder
    Member of Staff Who Banned Your Character: @Poopship McGee (Just ran the command)


    What Led To Your Character's Death?: I temporarily set up a stall made out of scrap, in order to sell off some of my own scrap. I placed it close to the gas station, near the bin I ICly crafted it from. Wilhelm (@GMK) wasn't happy with the fact I set up a stall next to his entire gas station, and thus tells me to move off of his property. I was just finishing up a few transactions, and then I did as he asked. So I moved across the road, off of his property in a place where I could still make a little bit of business but overall, not much. Wilhelm says it's okay, but I'll have to 'face the consequences'. After that point, a guy on MDMA came out with his makeshift car and we all had a bit of a joyride with him for the meantime. Then, Wilhelm says he's got a client (as someone who repairs guns, this is common) for us. He takes myself and Bill (@Simplest of the Simpler) to the garage part, showing us the client. We aren't told his name, but he's supposedly called Hans Zoller (@WeakenedHen5 ). He takes me out back after describing a situation regarding a gun and repairs, and pulls out a Submachine gun. He then does what is basically an S2K /me, despite the fact that I literally have no guns, no time to react and he didn't even let me do a /me reacts before he shot me down and killed me.
    Why Should Your Character Be Unbanned?: The 'hit' as it were, was incredibly stupid. I set up a stand with PET Flags, just to get a bit of my unwanted and unneeded scrap sold, and even when I move (note, that I moved across the road because Fives literally just asked me to get off of his property, which I did) he gets annoyed and instead of clarifying how he wants me to move, he calls in a hit and gets me killed.

    Aswell, the proper combat initiation wasn't done
    as shown in the logs, there wasn't any /mel at all. And from the sound of the submachine gun, I really doubt it was suppressed. Besides, he both took out the gun and shot me in the same /me, which (I'm not entirely certain and may be wrong) is against the rules.
    Date Of Occurrence: 25/03/2020 at around 21:10
    Evidence:
    *** [A German male with pale features, he ...] removes his firearm, squeezing the trigger and firing a volley of projectiles
    (He had already taken out his gun before doing this, from his inventory)

    Other Players Involved: @GMK @Simplest of the Simpler
    Any Other Details: Seems a bit... I don't know, excessive? Apparently the justification was because I was taking business, but they're a petrol station. I was just selling off some scrap, and I think I actually helped out business by getting a crowd to their shop. A couple people even came buy and bought petrol.
     
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  2. GMK

    GMK Electron
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    Give me an hour and I’ll rebuttal.
     
  3. WeakenedHen5

    WeakenedHen5 Molecule
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    I went to @GMK ’s char completely unrelated to this to buy ammo when he approaches me and says that if I perform a hit for him he would give me the ammo and a gun for free

    My character agreed and went into the corner and done a /mec of removing his weapon and stuffing it into his waistband

    the situation then unfolded as described the only thing I’ll hold my hands up to this is I didn’t use a /meL as I thought it had always just been a /me

    perhaps the /mec removing the weapon is against the rules also I apologise if that’s the case and he should be unPK’d

    also I initiated S2K so I don’t have to wait for you to react

    I only really performed the action, the PK reasons don’t really have much to do with me
     
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  4. Poopship McGee

    Poopship McGee Old Stock Canadian
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    Staff discussed the matter in op chat and determined that while you should certainly always do a /mel when opening up S2K, he was still within range of seeing the /me and it wouldn't completely over-ride the PK as a whole.

    We weren't going to NLR/void the death because there wasn't a /mel because that would be more ruleplay than roleplay.
     
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  5. WeakenedHen5

    WeakenedHen5 Molecule
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    Yes I agree totally. It’s more my own fault for not realising that from past experience I have assumed it was /me, so I apologise on that front
     
  6. Simplest of the Simpler

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    I didn’t really understand what was going on either, at least not until reading through this thread.

    My character (Bill Fudd), was present through the entire situation, except near the beginning after the stand setup when he had to run back to the shop in the city to grab a box of scrap metal. My character is also well acquainted with “Fives” (Wilhelm) and it was in my mind to reinforce the idea that the stand was going to be temporary for this one occasion at least.

    The scrap stand was soon attracting a lot of attention, and customers. Not only was there good roleplay going on but both branches were accumulating wealth, since the petroleum station was selling too. The stand had to be packed up and moved off the property for obvious reasons imo, I played no part in that besides selling off what all that was left towards a friendly customer.

    Anyways, after the MDMA car drifting dude settled down to refuel, “Fives” stated to Hans Godder that he had a client looking to talk and we both proceeded into the garage; promptly I shut the door behind to keep it private. Apparently, the client wanted his Luger and some SMG (probably a grease gun) repaired and we both stated we were ready to fix the Luger first-hand. The client asks Hans to follow him outside (through the cash register area and past the door leading to the back). The door was left open, whilst I struck up a conversation with “Fives” about the status of shipment deliveries.

    Shortly after “Fives” made his reply, we hear a rapid series of shots and I see through the corner of the door a dead body. No /me on my screen due to the proximity (and there was no /Mel allegedly). Both of us rush out and roleplay some stuff out with another dude who came along, before I had to log off for the night.

    I believe Hans Godder should receive an unPK because of the lack of /mel, which should have been done since the noise was so loud amongst what others have stated above me. I also believe that this was quite excessive and just...too quick? Where’s at least Hans getting to do a /me or something to confirm the occasion? It felt off, unexpected but not in the way it should have been. I get it that ruleplay has a part as the staff mentioned but this all seems to have happened in poor taste.
     
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  7. GMK

    GMK Electron
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    Right so here is my argument:

    You have a store presently, a garage in fact. You have the opportunity to sell your products out of that store and advertise your sales outside of that store. You also have the right to set up a stall anywhere you choose. But the consequences of your actions must apply.

    I told you to move your stall, and you did, right across the street. Before I even told you to move, I informed you of why and you fully understood what the complications were. I specifically said that you would be costing me customers and that’s exactly what happened. You seemingly disregarded it and even advertised your store on my property, you took the chance thinking that nothing would happen if you decided to park your business right across from mine with the sole intention of taking advantage of the foot traffic that I was profiting from with the same product. You wanted to be my direct competition and this is how I handle competition.

    you decided not to heed my warning and this is your consequence.

    The decision was already made about the /meL as well. So while I have read your argument pertaining to it, the stance on the staffs decision will now come down to PK management.
     
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  8. Shadok

    Shadok smol man rollenspieler

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    I agree with this. I was at the front of the store, and had I and other people heard what was happening or at least the gunshots we would've been able to track down the killer. Also, I think this PK shouldn't be public because you've exposed who ordered the kill, which was something I could never of guessed...
     
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  9. WeakenedHen5

    WeakenedHen5 Molecule
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    I can confirm this it was literally opposite the shop
     
  10. Silanus

    Silanus Happy Person
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    My original plan was actually to sell to the store, but not a single person who ran the store was online. You only came online after I had made the stall. And it was more to just sell some random shit we had on us, rather than actual services.
    Wrong. You infact managed to get two customers as well as a small-scale crowd outside of your garage, you could've taken the opportunity to advertise your own services but you didn't. You instead stood around, telling me to leave. That was entirely on you, not me.
    What? Do you have any proof that I advertised? All I said was that we had a Scrap Stall.
    You're a Petrol Station. You sell petrol as your main product. I took advantage of using a common location where people tend to gather in order to sell something, yes, but I was at high risk anyway due to it being out in the open. Especially considering what I was selling.
    1) Cringe
    2) I wanted to sell some shit and leave. I was going to leave shortly anyway, as I clearly fucked off doing the stall when I joined in on the joyrides.

    this whole 'consequence' mentality is megacringe, chief. You literally bought from me, which is basically me giving you things to sell. If I wanted to be your rival I'd simply say 'I won't sell to you'.

    The decision was agreed upon in /op, regarding it. But the fact that a PK Appeal has popped up, and pointed this clear breach in the rules, means there's a likelihood that it'll be considered as a reason for it to become invalid.

    It's entirely up to the PK Team, though.
     
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  11. GMK

    GMK Electron
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    I mean if you want to get the logs out then that’s cool man. I tried looking for the line where you said “We are the Automotors Store located in City” but I couldn’t see any logs outside of commands. So I’ll leave it up to PK management.
    Merged:
    Additionally I was online all day, I happened to head back to the store and notice that you were setting up a stall, which surprised the absolute hell out of me and the audacity of you to set up a stall outside of someone’s business lol
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  12. Silanus

    Silanus Happy Person
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    I didn't even say that.
    That was Bill. I didn't ask him to say that, and personally didn't even want him to.
     
  13. GMK

    GMK Electron
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    Logs will prove what I said my man.
    Merged:
    Looks like your friend helped get ya shot man what can I say. You could’ve avoided this by actually moving somewhere else instead of moving directly across the street.
     
  14. Silanus

    Silanus Happy Person
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    You weren't in the store at the time I set up, at least.
    I set up a stall literally made of trash and scrap. If you felt intimidated by that, then that's entirely your problem.
     
  15. WeakenedHen5

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    look man, I understand yes, I technically didn’t follow the rules to the letter however as Poopship said role play over ruleplay

    that brings this appeal down to the fact that you were making money on someone’s turf and you suffered the consequences of that actions. IMO pretty clear cut PK rules but eh what do I know
     
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  16. GMK

    GMK Electron
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    I feel that you shouldn’t set up a stall on someone else’s property lol. Knowing that there’s a lot of foot traffic and knowing that you offer the same services and sell the same goods.
     
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  17. Silanus

    Silanus Happy Person
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    Ditto.

    You can't seriously say I'm responsible for what he says. Someone asked who we are, and he chose to answer. If you're seriously thinking it's justified to get me killed because of something he said, then I'm questioning your genuine OOC Judgement as well as your IC Judgement.
    Merged:
    Mate you don't have to keep responding, this is between me and him.
    All you did was get payed and pull the trigger, don't get worked up over it.
     
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  18. Simplest of the Simpler

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    I’m pretty sure “Fives” knows where I work at since I introduced it on the first day we met near the checkpoint. I was assuming he hasn’t seen Hans Godder before so I said what was needed. However, in doing so, this was not intended to advertise but to be transparent, as a sign of mutual respect. IC Bill would do this, so I acted as his personality is.

    The stand sold goods toward “Fives” as well, since this was the original intention and then to just pack up and leave.
     
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  19. Shadok

    Shadok smol man rollenspieler

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    Also the fact there's a lot of armed people in the countryside now.
     
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  20. Jackround12353

    Jackround12353 citizen main

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    As the getaway driver and someone who saw it all partially unfold, I'd be more supportive of an NLR instead of PK-- although I do believe a PK is justified in the circumstances.

    I do think what you was doing was pretty dumb, and perhaps you should've seen something like this coming for deciding to setup next to his business let alone compete with it? I wouldn't recommend doing it again if your appeal gets accepted.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
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