Discussion in 'Accepted/Denied Appeals' started by nexus, Apr 6, 2019.
Rule 1 of D22 club: Don't walk into RB6 while working in D22
I fully agree in saying that the dude should have had detail and hell - if he knew so much he'd not even be allowed to leave the nexus but he was and I have no control over that, that's down to faction leads.
Personally, even if we saved the HVT, I'd of still shot him for going into RB6 by his own hand, knowing what he did given he committed a 99 and thus wasted our time and even got cops killed.
But that's just me.
Memes aside, my personal opinion?
The sweep happened. The dude wasn't found though, NLR refunds for all. That way they can make more RP with the dude without him dying or everyone else dying, and more can come from it than them being decked by cops (who I don't blame given what info they had to go off of).
I think we best leave it to the PK appeal folks & BQ now, but given this was a mess of misinformation, misunderstandings and only happened due to a delayed event and some odd info, I think this is just best solved without any deaths.
And have rebels that have a guy that knows so much and about OTA?
Sorry but no, if cops failed to find him there would be more sent out until he was found unfortunately, he knows too much. If you want to say that he was killed in the sweep and then NLR everyone else, that's something more reasonable.
But to take away the cops "victory" in this situation and refund everyone and let them keep the HVT, is not fair on us at all.
Equally though there was no way you wouldn't have won in that scenario, thats what I'm trying to get across here.
There's no harm in letting the dude stay in their hands for the sake of some more RP rather than instantly crushing it and making the entire exercise seem more like a piss-take than anything, y'know? I mean even if you snatched him another time it'd be preferable to "Oh you may as well have not kidnapped him at all".
Then again I suppose the Resistance does know D22 exists now, so there's that.
I think regardless of the outcome, a few things should definetely be elaborated on;
What evidence do you require to conduct a mass-scale sweep?
Should D22 members be allowed to walk around with no guards?
How the hell do trackers work?
not exactly the end of the union though- the only rebel-OTA interaction will still be s2k, and we know how that will turn out for rebels
We already have it noted down, as well as a good five-ish survivors that still possess all of the information. So nothing will change.
I think you just proved my point entirely of why I think the mentallity was messy when it came to this scenario. There is no us vs them, there is no "victory", this is the most CW thing I've heard since CW.
You can't OOCly assure something, disregard any conceptual In-Character sense in favor of "winning" and then complain because you might not "win". Just goes to show how OOCly motivated your mindset is if that's your genuine opinion.
not fair? are you kidding? the only reasons cops emerged “victorious” was because of map limitations. everybody knows where the outlands begins and where the outlands ends, which gives them the info necessary to sweep virtually every inch of it until they kill their target or recover their HVT (which they were unable to do because they saw it fit to massacre every fucking person they saw). it doesn’t help that they have a limitless ooc source of gear and manpower.
that’s not to mention the faulty info regarding his “trackers”, which realistically shouldn’t have pointed to him being anywhere at all. city 8 is a big place. he could’ve been anywhere.
and yet, for some odd reason, cops just knew that he must’ve been in this particular slice of the outskirts. so, let’s go in there, lob some grenades, and massacre em! good job guys, we won!
I think a lot of stuff is being repeated now and important information is being buried.
We should just wait for the PK guys to sit down and deal with this, and answer any questions they may have.
This is a slippery slope, I'll be honest. You can't use this because it is far too easy to dismiss literally any response with "How did you know it was us here?" and you just can't do that gameplay wise. It'd cause way too many problems and is far too easy of a copout.
They swept because they got told there was a UIl dude with two gunmen in the sewers, after all, on top of everything else.
Not why I personally swept, but I agree with the other things you said.
If only there were some large map capable of moving and hiding characters around to avoid situations where even large scale sweeps wouldn't necessarily be able to comb absolutely everywhere for a single HVT. Maybe something outside of the city walls, like, an outer plains, or an external lands. What an interesting concept.
All in all there should be some restriction for the sake of balance, but how exactly you iron such things out isn't exactly an easy task.
This is a key point.
As I've been trying to say for a while now; as much as I love the fact rebels are kidnapping people, bombing things and making a dent I don't know how you draw the line for a response that makes people actually feel like what they did was risky and be satisfying for the people who've been getting clapped for a while.
There's no easy answer here. NPC's and barriers are treated as OOC jokes, not an IC effort of "hey, don't push your luck too much" which is why sweeps are relied upon to remind people that their actions have risk in some form.
Yeah, honestly don't blame anyone for reacting the way they do. It's just unavoidable in a really tough way. Especially when we take every realistic precaution but because of the standard, it's just how it is. We can't exactly be anywhere but out there. Map paired with dynamic fucks everyone in a bad way.
We literally just swept ela and railway nothing else
I want to give one last piece on this topic, that I thought of as I fell asleep last night and forgot about till now; the report shouldn't really be classed as 'hearsay' as my character is a blue tier USE worker that has been applauded by a senator for their devout nature. I'd honestly 100% agree on calling my report 'hearsay' if I was just your standard citizen, but a mid tier, extremely devout loyalist should be taken more seriously when they report something imo
You’re right, but a sweep would not have happened if you look at all the other signs, the only reason you really had to sweep this area was due to ghostkripp wanting money (nothing wrong with lying incharacter)
If he was found, he was dead. Fighting was his only real chance at survival
I dunno how else to say it but there are some people in the community who only take things IC as it suits them, and these people are the exact reason rebels are responded to as harshly and directly as they are. There's a lot of good RPers - and they know who they are - who'll see shellings and go "they could flatten us, lets cool it off" or "Man, I could get turned into a fucking zombie jesus fuck" or who'll see manhacks and realise there's no shortage of them to fuck you up.
But people don't. What invariably happens is the bad people shrug these off as inconveniences on an OOC level, who make them an OOC issue before going right back to repeatedly kicking the Union in the teeth with little-to-no breaks between them. Their character isn't at risk from fucking NPC's compared to actual units, so why take the hint?
So eventually the only response is a sweep, and it fucks people over. I wish it wasn't that way, because there's so many fantastic people but this selective IC thinking hurts everyone.
That's a big lie, you zig-zagged whole area, breach or not. And like clarified in opchat, you were going to keep looking until you found your target regardless, so it wouldn't have mattered, place was getting weeded.