Deus Ex: Invisible War thread

[depthjacks]

Jokes aside, if the game wasnt so broken technically wise, it could be very good. The story isnt so bad, it does a lot of things well.

Also for some reason people hated the fact that deus ex 2 removed the points system and had universal ammo. Ok lets be real here, the points system in deus ex was kinda unpolished, be it if you wanna be a tech guy, you gotta invest into 3 categories, while if you wanna a guns blazing guy, just invest into rifle, get a sniper and become a headshot machine. No scope sway, pin point accuracy.

Also the universal ammo system is great, since it gives you the chance of using the right weapon for the right time.

EDIT: i will post this video link on purpose, it examines deus ex 1, invisible war and human revolution, also MAKE SURE THAT YOU ACTUALLY WATCH THIS VIDEO TO THE END AND LISTEN!


EDIT 2: Dear lord what did i just make. This thread is going haywire. Well its been an honour Mrs. Obama

 

['77 East]

Also the universal ammo system is great, since it gives you the chance of using the right weapon for the right time.

Except when you realize that the system rewards you for going guns blazing instead of thinking strategically - in DX1 you couldn't blow open every door without running out of limited grenades or rockets, whereas here you can shoot ten people for more Universal Ammo and then start firing your rocketlauncher everywhere like a killstreak reward. There's no satisfaction for stealthing, which is again broken here, and the A.I has less self-preservation than the original's.

Plus, the Liberty final sucks since half the whole point post-Unatco is merely to either snipe out or just run rings around all the Rocket Paladins that spawn (unless you're going the Templar route for some inane reason) provided you have the running aug at a decent level or the projectile self-defense aug. Unless you can manage to scrounge up ammo (hint: you really can't even if you batter them all down with a melee weapon) you'll run out quick and have to flee or get vaporized.

Also for some reason people hated the fact that deus ex 2 removed the points system and had universal ammo. Ok lets be real here, the points system in deus ex was kinda unpolished, be it if you wanna be a tech guy, you gotta invest into 3 categories, while if you wanna a guns blazing guy, just invest into rifle, get a sniper and become a headshot machine. No scope sway, pin point accuracy.

It doesn't help that you really just need to sidestep at times to grab a large bunch of biomods, in the original game you often had to traverse half the map and dedicate time to finding them beyond "oh, let's walk into the next room and open this cabinet for THREE upgrade canisters!"

Points system kept Deus Ex as an RPG, with it gone it was no longer a 'real' RPG beyond fucking around with whatever (limited) biomods you wanted and how you responded to X dialogue options, most of which consisted of either "no", "no but fuck you too", or "yes I will do fetch quest X".

Jokes aside, if the game wasnt so broken technically wise, it could be very good. The story isnt so bad, it does a lot of things well.

It was too dumbed down both in story and 'functionality' that it can't really serve as a Deus Ex game in any meaningful capacity, even the philosophy is confined to the one brief encounter with JC in Antarctica, then it's just more mindless fetch-quests as the dialogue goes back to the previous sub-par quality. Mind you, it's still better than the mobile game that came out half a decade ago.

 

[Akula]

disliking people with super robot strength and have killed people in the past is basically racism

biting social commentary

e: wait fuck wrong deus ex

invisible war is just the retarded one innit

 

[depthjacks]

I have to disagree with the weapon part, for that there were weapon upgrades. Lets say you have a pistol. If you get an glass disabling upgrade, and emp upgrade and a silencer, you just got a multi purpose tool. The way how the guns blazing issue was fixed, it was with these upgrades, also without them your weapons would sometimes be weak.

The default smg is weak againts some enemies, but if you get an ammo scavenge and explosive bullets, now THAT is guns blazing. Another thing are the biomods. They were made like that on purpose. In deus ex 2 you could change them at any time so that you wont be married to whatever upgrades you had, it let you to be creative, the fact that you had 3 biomod canisters in the beginning wasnt a mistake, it WAS made like that on purpose.

And about the points part of deus ex 1, yeah i gotta agree thet had to make it an rpg, but why add so many useless things, hell you even explained that augs and consumables were cheaper and more effective. The problem is not what its trying to do, but its that is useless.

 

['77 East]

I have to disagree with the weapon part, for that there were weapon upgrades. Lets say you have a pistol. If you get an glass disabling upgrade, and emp upgrade and a silencer, you just got a multi purpose tool. The way how the guns blazing issue was fixed, it was with these upgrades, also without them your weapons would sometimes be weak.

The default smg is weak againts some enemies, but if you get an ammo scavenge and explosive bullets, now THAT is guns blazing.

doesn't fix the incentive because you need to kill about 10 people to get enough ammo for a full rocket launcher/end-tier weapon so Liberty Island takes ages to get through

add to the fact that paladins blow up so you can't loot them (same with Illuminati clones) and the rocketspam and it's an annoying gauntlet unless you have the running aug maxed and just jump/dodge everything as you speed past. you'll find that I wasn't talking about the weapons themselves, but rather the fact that Universal Ammunition encourages you to drop people with X weapon so you stick to it rather than branching out because you're empty with one thing.

Another thing are the biomods. They were made like that on purpose. In deus ex 2 you could change them at any time so that you wont be married to whatever upgrades you had, it let you to be creative, the fact that you had 3 biomod canisters in the beginning wasnt a mistake, it WAS made like that on purpose.

except you still have to spend points to reverse things and given most of them are lumped together you end up spending half your points flip-flopping instead of upgrading them

aside from one particular aug I find black market biomods useless as well, which is funny considering they're emphasized as the 'best' thing to get in the game

And about the points part of deus ex 1, yeah i gotta agree thet had to make it an rpg, but why add so many useless things, hell you even explained that augs and consumables were cheaper and more effective. The problem is not what its trying to do, but its that is useless.

Consumables hold little merit in DX2 outside of giving you slivers of health; multitools are found so commonly (except for Liberty island of all places) that you can walk into one part of the map and use the stuff you find there to outright ransack everything. Augs are handed out like candy but the problem remains that most of the 'good' and desired ones are lumped together forcing you to delicately pick and choose one style (e.g no invisibility if you want to get the hacking aug so you can actually unlock doors). Points, by contrast, gave you the incentive to stick to one style because you had already done stuff with it before branching out once you got more, and encouraged different options on other playthroughs. DX2 doesn't do that because outside of the lackluster sidemissions, there's little replay value to begin with and you can't really do anything other than change from stealth to 'kill everything with a gun' and vice-versa.

Loading screens everywhere suck too.

 

[depthjacks]

I decided to post a video on the threads beginning, it explains deus ex 1, invisible war and human revolution in detail. Trust me, just watch it.

 

['77 East]

I decided to post a video on the threads beginning, it explains deus ex 1, invisible war and human revolution in detail. Trust me, just watch it.

heard the guy just say Mankind Divided was 100% the same as Human Revolution so he would skim it

hard pass

 

[depthjacks]

heard the guy just say Mankind Divided was 100% the same as Human Revolution so he would skim it

hard pass

Then sadly i have no other way of showing the good and bad stuff. And reason why I cant, is because of the language barrier, and time. Also he reviewed it in his 2016 in review video.

 

['77 East]

Then sadly i have no other way of showing the good and bad stuff. And reason why I cant, is because of the language barrier, and time.

I'm still watching it though, I'll get back to you once I'm done.

 

[depthjacks]

I'm still watching it though, I'll get back to you once I'm done.

Forgot to type that he reviewed deus ex Mankind divided in his 2016 in review video.

 

['77 East]

He's wrong about the weapons; just because some are useless in certain scenarios (SMG being crap mid-range) doesn't mean they have other uses (re: using 20mm ammo in it and just taking it as a discount grenade launcher) and to be quite honest you don't need to rely on the sniper rifle to snipe, getting max in the pistol skill and grabbing a stealth pistol modded with a scope and you have the same thing.

As for Universal Ammo, if in any of the other games I run around and empty all my pistol ammo into someone, I still have fallback weapons. In DX2, I don't because I just used all my ammo and have to resort to grenades with less range than the HL1 pineapple, or melee weapons that ultimately do little unless you have good kamikaze skills.

 

[depthjacks]

He's wrong about the weapons; just because some are useless in certain scenarios (SMG being crap mid-range) doesn't mean they have other uses (re: using 20mm ammo in it and just taking it as a discount grenade launcher) and to be quite honest you don't need to rely on the sniper rifle to snipe, getting max in the pistol skill and grabbing a stealth pistol modded with a scope and you have the same thing.

As for Universal Ammo, if in any of the other games I run around and empty all my pistol ammo into someone, I still have fallback weapons. In DX2, I don't because I just used all my ammo and have to resort to grenades with less range than the HL1 pineapple, or melee weapons that ultimately do little unless you have good kamikaze skills.

Will respond later, gonna be busy irl.

 

[Blackquill]

disliking people with super robot strength and have killed people in the past is basically racism

biting social commentary

e: wait fuck wrong deus ex

invisible war is just the retarded one innit

The racism analogy in Mankind Divided is clumsy because Racism in real life is based on the irrational dislike of people different than yourself for things out of their control and actions that aren't related to them. I can see where MD is making the comparison

But the reason why Augs become segregated in Mankind Divided is because in Human Revolution, everyone with augs has a 'kill switch' flipped and they all go beserk, go around attacking and killing people. It's hard to see that as irrational fear in the context of augmentations. Not saying It's right but it's understandable when this semi-new technology can basically turn people into killing machines without any prior notice or warning.

 

['77 East]

But the reason why Augs become segregated in Mankind Divided is because in Human Revolution, everyone with augs has a 'kill switch' flipped and they all go beserk, go around attacking and killing people. It's hard to see that as irrational fear in the context of augmentations. Not saying It's right but it's understandable when this semi-new technology can basically turn people into killing machines without any prior notice or warning.

You mean they were given massive hallucinations via their augmentations and driven to near-insanity, with certain constant glitches leading up to the 'tragedy' that occurred, signifying that it was just 'one giant error' so 'please regulate and ban all augs, transhumans r bad' - at least, from the lore perspective.

All technology can be used maliciously, everything from vehicles to simple tools have been used to maim and kill, hence the fear of the unknown plays a crucial role here.

 

[Blackquill]

you mean they were given massive hallucinations via their augmentations and driven to near-insanity, with certain constant glitches leading up to the 'tragedy' that occurred, signifying that it was just 'one giant error' so 'please regulate and ban all augs, transhumans r bad'.

Yeah it works as a technology metaphor

But as a racism analogy it just feels clumsy. Race is something nobody really has control over but Augmentations aren't something people were born with. I disagree with the whole purity thing in the games since I think that's not how it'd go down realistically. I believe if we had augs on part with the ones in the Deus Ex most people would embrace them because they would give the disabled a new lease on life

 

[Akula]

I felt it was extremely forced and didn't have much thought put into it beyond PEOPLE DO NOT LIKE PEOPLE WHO ARE DIFFERENT, TRULY WE LIVE IN A SOCIETY
[doublepost=1544012406][/doublepost]it feels like a less blatant Detroit: Become Human

 

['77 East]

I felt it was extremely forced and didn't have much thought put into it beyond PEOPLE DO NOT LIKE PEOPLE WHO ARE DIFFERENT, TRULY WE LIVE IN A SOCIETY

didn't help that it pandered immensely to the whole post-9/11 angle before throwing the entire thing aside bc "it was all a conspiracy LOL the illuminati love duality and shit, now choose between religious nazis, a walking god and misguided people who seek to enslave humanity, FIGHT TERRORISM AND SAVE THE WORLD"

unironically if the 'new' cabal had a sense of purpose or even the vision of the old Illuminati (Stanton Dowd/Everette) it wouldn't have come off so clunky, and that's giving them the benefit of the doubt regarding that the whole 'state-ism encourages terrorism and vice-versa' angle was intentionally put in and wasn't some presumed aftereffect

what makes it even worse is that the people leading them [Nicolette and Chad] are the people in DX1 who were outright resisting their remnants and didn't want to get involved with the greater 'war' that was going on.

 

[Blackquill]

Reminder that Deus ex 1 predicted 9/11

 

[Akula]

 

['77 East]

Reminder that Deus ex 1 predicted 9/11

rendering issues = prophecy

they were right about the whole proxy usage of memes as information awareness too though