hl2rp² feedback thread 2.0²

[Andrew]

Also, don't rag on @MaXenzie - he really isn't wrong. Gmod's way of doing things really ISN'T normal for the wider RP scene, whether text based or those in other games.

Conflict that ends in death isn't the norm because the game systems don't often support it and the setting isn't as hostile/dangerous as HL2's is.

Conflict that ends in death in other games wouldn't typically be the norm due to those games having higher preference outright on staying alive, or not featuring it at all - focusing more on telling a focused story rather than the 24/7 server we have up now, or outright not combat-focused
Many games don't even have the ability to directly attack other players, hence why you don't see stuff like you do on gmod

I agree. That's what makes HL2RP so special and why it has survived for so many years- nothing grows stale because characters come and go so you have new stories constantly beginning. Unfortunately Nebulous took the route of giving people a blanket safety to get away with practically everything so now it's turned into a SMP and as a result mindsets birth like the above. Shame!

very much so. having a rotating-door forced on you maintains a steady stream of testing new ideas and letting old stems get trimmed - there's so many characters that're from people who retired or used to play a lot who've had zero sendoff or remembrance because at any point in time those people can just... reinstall the game and flag back up, they never died or got got in a failed attempt to do something

 

[john]

there were a MILLION things wrong with that thread and I WISH I could speak about them but- I'd rather not

dogshit report full of people dropping someone's nitpicked selective discord-history over half a year (while being just as bad themselves) 🤮

speak abt it who cares

 

[Appetite Ruining Kebab]

hey that was my idea 😀love you @Appetite Ruining Kebab

i thought it was fucking hilarious cunts were trying to make a monster out of me and i had to remind them i have a birthday (human being moment)

i went out drinking and the report gave me an excuse to detox from forums for a day it was nice tbh

 

[Tinbe]

Maybe it's a more "me" problem, but when I put my heart and soul into something, it tends to hurt when that something is taken away. I've had times where I've been ready to give such things away, but I just don't have a set "expiration date" after which I am immediately ready to proceed with it. Much prefer going by feeling, instead of adhering to some more or less abstract schedule, you know?

Spoiler: Examples of giving away

UNION-8, high society violinist who became broken with trauma of service in Civil Protection, ready to be executed by rebels (and suicide pill as a precaution). They instead managed to capture him, after which OTA went to grab him - and decided to execute him when the whole operation was proving too much of a hassle in the middle of the final Geneva offensive.

Abraham Franklin, an elderly man trying to live out the dream of owning a diner shared by his then-late wife with what little time he had left on earth. Plenty interesting interactions with visitors before the stress of the war surrounding him beyond his understanding began to wear him out, to the point he passed of old age inside his diner. Too bad his death setpiece was propblocked by someone for some reason.

And then there's my Panthereye that terrorized everyone from Prahova valley to the rooftops of Bucharest. With the return to valley spelling inevitable doom from the debut of Race X, I thought I'd do a sendoff for this character - having roleplayed getting critically injured by pit drones. People got to see a passing of the metaphorical torch as a vortigaunt was entrusted with its egg before it hobbled away and succumbed to its wounds all dramatic-like.

(This sentiment goes both ways of course, I can't imagine myself taking away someone else's character at the drop of a hat.)

 

[rob]

Maybe it's a more "me" problem, but when I put my heart and soul into something, it tends to hurt when that something is taken away. I've had times where I've been ready to give such things away, but I just don't have a set "expiration date" after which I am immediately ready to proceed with it. Much prefer going by feeling, instead of adhering to some more or less abstract schedule, you know?

Spoiler: Examples of giving away

UNION-8, high society violinist who became broken with trauma of service in Civil Protection, ready to be executed by rebels (and suicide pill as a precaution). They instead managed to capture him, after which OTA went to grab him - and decided to execute him when the whole operation was proving too much of a hassle in the middle of the final Geneva offensive.

Abraham Franklin, an elderly man trying to live out the dream of owning a diner shared by his then-late wife with what little time he had left on earth. Plenty interesting interactions with visitors before the stress of the war surrounding him beyond his understanding began to wear him out, to the point he passed of old age inside his diner. Too bad his death setpiece was propblocked by someone for some reason.

And then there's my Panthereye that terrorized everyone from Prahova valley to the rooftops of Bucharest. With the return to valley spelling inevitable doom from the debut of Race X, I thought I'd do a sendoff for this character - having roleplayed getting critically injured by pit drones. People got to see a passing of the metaphorical torch as a vortigaunt was entrusted with its egg before it hobbled away and succumbed to its wounds all dramatic-like.

(This sentiment goes both ways of course, I can't imagine myself taking away someone else's character at the drop of a hat.)

If you put your heart and soul into a character, you should be the one to decide when they die, plain & simple.

It sucks to have an unsatisfying end to your character, and nobody deserves it - in fact, it can drive some people away from the server.

 

[MaXenzie]

(This sentiment goes both ways of course, I can't imagine myself taking away someone else's character at the drop of a hat.)

same

as much as people rag on me for being a pussy, i extend the courtesy i expect from others, to others
i will PM someone before i even initiate a fight, asking them if they're good with it
and if not, my character comes up with an excuse

@Toriwarior30055 can (hopefully) attest to that back in apocalypse or whatever that damn map was called.

 

['77 East]

can someone tell me why we traded a dev that the server desperately need for core functions

for an aggravated moron who blames all his self-fuckups on others, can't get over CAB having existed once, lead the RL cadre into a cesspool worse than pumpkin's clique fantasy back in the day and who sucks off racist cops irl boasting about wanting to lynch black people?

the same guy who threw a tantrum when his genius idea of walling his whole squad inside a one-exit building didn't work and tried to spitefully punish others only to be told he was acting out of line by faction leads? the same guy who tried it again when launching his attempted coup d'etat that literally blew up on his face then railed about it on VOIP? the same guy who messed up a hostage situation and railed off at the event maker for his own poor decision?

and you want him in charge of the sole faction that was intended to be roleplay-centric this time around, the transhuman arm?

@OneClassyBanana and @Erkor convinced me, me, after seeing 10 years of it being a server purge tool that it could actually function as a hub for character development - and this is what you do, you hand the reigns over to a blatant, vile fuckup who gets off on shoot-to-kill gaming because this server isn't for roleplay to him, it's a deathmatch whingefest.

@Kiko's okay but for fuck's sake what were you thinking @Numbers, you already had @sky & @PeaceAndMagick89 walk away because of how fucked it had gotten and you decide to promote the mentality even more by doing this?

you discussed with me how vital it was that we had developers again. I remember that conversation. you remember it.
this was not the sane course of action you assumed it was.

 

[deathwolf]

can someone tell me why we traded a dev that the server desperately need for core functions

for an aggravated moron who blames all his self-fuckups on others, can't get over CAB having existed once, lead the RL cadre into a cesspool worse than pumpkin's clique fantasy back in the day and who sucks off racist cops irl boasting about wanting to lynch black people?

the same guy who threw a tantrum when his genius idea of walling his whole squad inside a one-exit building didn't work and tried to spitefully punish others only to be told he was acting out of line by faction leads? the same guy who tried it again when launching his attempted coup d'etat that literally blew up on his face then railed about it on VOIP? the same guy who messed up a hostage situation and railed off at the event maker for his own poor decision?

and you want him in charge of the sole faction that was intended to be roleplay-centric this time around, the transhuman arm?

i think another RP/event focused lead might be a cool idea to team up with Brandon

 

[MaXenzie]

can someone tell me why we traded a dev that the server desperately need for core functions

for an aggravated moron who blames all his self-fuckups on others, can't get over CAB having existed once, lead the RL cadre into a cesspool worse than pumpkin's clique fantasy back in the day and who sucks off racist cops irl boasting about wanting to lynch black people?

the same guy who threw a tantrum when his genius idea of walling his whole squad inside a one-exit building didn't work and tried to spitefully punish others only to be told he was acting out of line by faction leads? the same guy who tried it again when launching his attempted coup d'etat that literally blew up on his face then railed about it on VOIP? the same guy who messed up a hostage situation and railed off at the event maker for his own poor decision?

and you want him in charge of the sole faction that was intended to be roleplay-centric this time around, the transhuman arm?

@OneClassyBanana and @Erkor convinced me, me, after seeing 10 years of it being a server purge tool that it could actually function as a hub for character development - and this is what you do, you hand the reigns over to a blatant, vile fuckup who gets off on shoot-to-kill gaming because this server isn't for roleplay to him, it's a deathmatch whingefest.

@Kiko's okay but for fuck's sake what were you thinking @Numbers, you already had @sky & @PeaceAndMagick89 walk away because of how fucked it had gotten and you decide to promote the mentality even more by doing this?

you discussed with me how vital it was that we had developers again. I remember that conversation. you remember it.
this was not the sane course of action you assumed it was.

i think it'd be because i was a rancid dickhead to ron on repeated occasions and kept irrationally throwing the blame on him for the server's less than stellar areas.

i can only assume ron gave numbers an ultimatum between banning me or him resigning and numbers chose to not ban me
but i'd get @Ron to give his take if anything, because all i know is im likely responsible for his departure

i doubt numbers had neither time nor mental capacity (not calling him stupid dw) to think of someone else to fill in the slot, the man's mentally drained enough as is. finished university like two weeks ago, hasn't been fully filled in on what's going on, and then he had to deal with that shit

i think the only thing numbers wants is a breather

 

[john]

ive pked a lot of people (and have been an unapologetic menace) but in the last year or so ive defo come around to the idea that theyre handled silly
what i liked was that i could die at any time and im kinda a adrenaline junkie and it was the status quoa so i perpetuated it but its not fun narratively

instead of pk appeals, there should be pk auths, you make an application to pk someone else
provide proof and motivate why you've tried everything else and most importantly already had a confrontation abt the issue with the other player (and nothing has changed)

why the burden of proof is on the defendant is pretty wild

 

['77 East]

i think it'd be because i was a rancid dickhead to ron on repeated occasions and kept irrationally throwing the blame on him for the server's less than stellar areas.

I'm talking about faction management here, although I have heard contradicting statements on the what & why of why Ron resigned.

My point remains pretty much simple - this wasn't a pick of candidates, this was a fucking stellar botch job when we're all sitting on threads trying to get this place off life support, and the decision is made to go with the guy who couldn't RP to save his own life, detests roleplay in favour of stalker: shadow of chernobyl (2007) faction skirmishes 24/7 and worships an actual blue-liner fantasizing about race wars?

That's not the sort of person needed to get a faction that is intended to provide - and function for - roleplay opportunities off the ground again.

 

[MaXenzie]

I'm talking about faction management here, although I have heard contradicting statements on the what & why of why Ron resigned.

My point remains pretty much simple - this wasn't a pick of candidates, this was a fucking stellar botch job when we're all sitting on threads trying to get this place off life support, and the decision is made to go with the guy who couldn't RP to save his own life, detests roleplay in favour of stalker: shadow of chernobyl (2007) faction skirmishes 24/7 and worships an actual blue-liner fantasizing about race wars?

That's not the sort of person needed to get a faction that is intended to provide - and function for - roleplay opportunities off the ground again.

i dont personally know brandon or his leadership capability skills
i know one goofy thing he did in C24 during an innkeeper event and thats about it

truthfully though, are there any candidates to pick from

 

['77 East]

so tell me again why the new co-lead of a faction is LARPing as an enclave member from Fallout 2?

we going to see Dick Richardson show up next?
who's going to play him, snowl?

 

[Ron]

so tell me again why the new co-lead of a faction is LARPing as an enclave member from Fallout 2?

we going to see Dick Richardson show up next?
who's going to play him, snowl?

I set that as my commander's name as a joke and when I appointed (yes, me) Brandon to lead Combine before I left, I just didn't change it because it's comical. Anyways, there wasn't anyone else able or willing to lead Combine and Numbers wouldn't have done it on his own since he'll have Uni soon. You don't even play anymore, stop the Australian on Australian violence.

 

['77 East]

it's comical

You could say the same about the gestapo uniforms past headcops wore, doesn't mean they or this weren't rulebreaks.
What happened to playing a character, man?

Seriously, this is supposed to be a roleplay server, how the fuck is it roleplay if you're just baiting for meme value at that point?

It's seriously low, especially when this iteration was touted as making them actual characters and this as considered the example to lead by. I'd be on board with it if it was still the exclusive server deathsquad tool that it was back in Evil or 2Stronk's day - but it's not those days anymore, and the faction is not just that now.

You don't even play anymore

This is a pathetic excuse, just because I'm busy working and haven't joined recently doesn't mean anything, the attitudes and problems that existed while I was playing a cop still exist - and if anything, have gotten even worse as this shows - with no recourse. Why don't we ban eighty percent of recent posters while we're at it because they haven't joined in a month?

Anyways, there wasn't anyone else able or willing

You have seven other members on that roster at near-peer rank, ignoring 23 that are phase one or low-ranked phase two.
How many are on LOA?

Numbers wouldn't have done it on his own since he'll have Uni soon.

Numbers has been away longer than he's been on the server, he's been wanting a breather for six months.

@Blackquill had Ronald, he should seriously think about focusing on his life and getting someone to co-SD alongside him. Hell, kidnap @Rabid.

stop the Australian on Australian violence

@Subeh put the axe away, some foreigner's telling us to give up our national sport.

 

[Ron]

You could say the same about the gestapo uniforms past headcops wore, doesn't mean they or this weren't rulebreaks.
What happened to playing a character, man?

Seriously, this is supposed to be a roleplay server, how the fuck is it roleplay if you're just baiting for meme value at that point?

It's seriously low, especially when this iteration was touted as making them actual characters and this as considered the example to lead by. I'd be on board with it if it was still the exclusive server deathsquad tool that it was back in Evil or 2Stronk's day - but it's not those days anymore, and the faction is not just that now.

its not that deep, brother. The alternative was [data redacted] because the char started off as OTA not as a cop. the rest of your post doesn't have much worth replying to, but I appreciate you writing it regardless

 

[MaXenzie]

the server’s still chugging along.
we can at least be grateful for that

 

[Thood74]

merge the cops and resistance together and pit them against a greater foe so that the server is no longer built on an antagonistic dichotomy and we can focus on cooperative storytelling against an enemy that is predominantly played by staff.

I know we're very late into the conversation by now and past this, but it seems like conversation has died down again and this was actually an idea that on the surface had a lot of promise, but I feel theres very notable issues that aren't brought up enough and it seems like a good time to try and discuss them. Mainly because I'd like more conversation or at least deconstructing my ideas as to why it would not work may end up revealing something useful.

Spoiler: A lot of text

The main problem in my eyes is that its entirely detached from what the intention with Civil Protection is. A dehumanised paramilitary force meant to be as unwelcoming as possible and detach collaborators who join it from the people they oppress(ed). Seeing how this REALLY did not change in the slightest in structure, appearance/aesthetic, equipment or even initially purpose with their first endeavour on the server being a return to their traditional role of policing a refugee camp, it did not sell any sort of post-occupation change whatsoever beyond the cults that have died out by now and I feel like its a fatal misstep that'd be very hard to go back on now with all the groundwork laid down and Civil Protection already being established as quite inflexable regardless of setting changes throughout the iteration, never once making any particularly fundamental changes up until very recently where you could consider divisions as one, albeit without serving the goal of pointing the faction in any particularly new direction outside of organisation and XRAYs more roleplay friendly nature in particular.

I know a cooperative roleplaying experience would be better, and this is an attempt to put the two forces together without effectively cutting one half of the server out of the storyline, but like, how do you make that happen in a way that makes in universe sense? Its opposed to the Combines oppressive nature and I doubt any work beyond maybe giving cops spray painted uniforms would be put in to reasonably combine the twos aesthetic to make something new rather than just having the two operate in tandem as a sort of coalition with some very major contrast that comes with it.

And what enemy takes over to oppose the two? all nonhuman Combine forces? Nothing new, and it'd probably rightly annoy some people holding the OTA whitelist at this moment to be reduced to a pseudo-NPC event faction. Race X or Xen? An alien enemy of their kind risks becoming kind of boring and lacking any interesting motives or interactions that dont play on their animalistic tendencies, being even more limited in potential interactions than the Combine as is.

A third party human faction? Okay, how do we go about characterising them, giving them a unique identity, motive and appearance and generally make them actually interesting in a way that preferably plays to HL2s almost apocalyptic sci fi world and elements in it instead of just slavers or mercs working for whatever johnny bad guy wants to take over and do X thing before we inevitably beat them? The Emergent Society felt like the best attempt at a 'third party faction' with its own identity, purpose and culture, but never one that felt like it could be a force to oppose both of the other factions, let alone when they're working together for a mutual goal.

And on that, what would the overarching goal even be for the two factions that could possibly unite them and refocus the servers storyline without any inconsolable issues between the two beyond the 'CPs gets betrayed out of nowhere, fuck you' possibility? It's a lot, too much to possibly pull off this late into the server if I had to say.

I'm sorry if this all seems out of left field or maybe aggressive at some points, but I'd actually, genuinely like to dissect this idea for once. Because it does hold quite a bit of promise and also conveniently allows me to bring up some of the inherent flaws in Civil Protection in a post-occupation setting. Also sorry if this doesn't entirely hold up, I'm very tired rn and my insight into current server affairs is very limited. I'm moreso hoping something will change to reel me back in because as of now I don't feel like getting back into Civil Protection and the less structured albeit more free rebel stuff doesn't appeal to me.

Good night.

 

[Generally Fruity]

And what enemy takes over to oppose the two? all nonhuman Combine forces? Nothing new, and it'd probably rightly annoy some people holding the OTA whitelist at this moment to be reduced to a pseudo-NPC event faction. Race X or Xen? An alien enemy of their kind risks becoming kind of boring and lacking any interesting motives or interactions that dont play on their animalistic tendencies, being even more limited in potential interactions than the Combine as is.

A third party human faction? Okay, how do we go about characterising them, giving them a unique identity, motive and appearance and generally make them actually interesting in a way that preferably plays to HL2s almost apocalyptic sci fi world and elements in it instead of just slavers or mercs working for whatever johnny bad guy wants to take over and do X thing before we inevitably beat them? The Emergent Society felt like the best attempt at a 'third party faction' with its own identity, purpose and culture, but never one that felt like it could be a force to oppose both of the other factions, let alone when they're working together for a mutual goal.

 

[deathwolf]

i see a sopranos gif, i neb.

i didn’t even see the post you replied to