Suggestion Rework Rogue Cops

[MaXenzie]

This is not true in the sense that a bounty was put out on him and after a short while he was killed, by me.

after i told you he was a serial killer

i dont know why i needed to tell you, he was on the bounty board as "WANTED: DEAD" for serial bombings

and you were originally going there to buy drugs lmao

 

[Raiden]

after i told you he was a serial killer

i dont know why i needed to tell you, he was on the bounty board as "WANTED: DEAD" for serial bombings

and you were originally going there to buy drugs lmao

I actually didnt know oocly or icly about the crates or bounties, its true i went there to buy drugs for “””different reasons””” i did ultimately kill him for moral reasons rather then for drug reasons, given what i had seen on the wanted posters and what people told me

 

[Raiden]

My point being I resent the idea that most of rebel rpers these days are script hungry.

 

[MaXenzie]

My point being I resent the idea that most of rebel rpers these days are script hungry.

ngl there were definitely a lot of rebels who knew XRAY was a serial killer who did not care

literally the first thing you see when you walked into the rebel base on the previous map was a wanted board, with which X-RAY was like the only occupant on it

there would be conversations every other day about being careful because X-RAY had planted trapped crates about

i saw, in person, someone die in a house fire because they opened an X-RAY crate and it exploded in his face

and then i'd still see people talking to X-RAY, ON OUR RADIO, about getting some meth

so yes i will automatically discount any moral argument you make against rogue cops, because its clear a majority of rebel players would be a-okay with teamkilling fucktards so long as they have a crafting flag

 

[Mike65536]

My point being I resent the idea that most of rebel rpers these days are script hungry.

Mfw you bombed him the literal moment I got back with backup.

 

[ovxy]

yes it is

i was in his fucking den
with him
where he showed me a live stream of all his bombs locations
and said
to my face
"i kill people for a live-stream of 3 viewers"

and then john doe crushed him with a computer because he'd just admitted that he literally got off on the idea of randomly murdering and maiming people

holy shit hl2rp riddler

 

[Ond]

obviously circumstances apply, and if it's 4 days later you're obviously not trying to loophole. I'm referring to if you just disappear immediately after for a week the moment you go rouge etc

you have no way to prove if someone went offline because they genuinely can't play or if they are trying to dodge some arbitrarily set death window

 

[Komchan]

you have no way to prove if someone went offline because they genuinely can't play or if they are trying to dodge some arbitrarily set death window

Yeah but you can look into it, as it'd be quite suspicious, or void it and have it occur at a later date, etc.

Maybe longer then a week honestly, maybe like, first month there's PK risk? If they just avoid the server for a month immediately after going rouge, that'd be an outright red flag.

 

[Ond]

Yeah but you can look into it, as it'd be quite suspicious, or void it and have it occur at a later date, etc.

Maybe longer then a week honestly, maybe like, first month there's PK risk? If they just avoid the server for a month immediately after going rouge, that'd be an outright red flag.

i think as long as the escape takes place during peak hours and they get away its fine, seriously

arbitrary death perm pk windows are so dumb regardless of the length

saying someone WILL get pk'd no matter how they die (even an NPC killing them) just motivates people to do as little as possible and be pseudo-afk instead

 

[FreeSpy]

2) Rogue Cops abide by the same PK rules as everyone else.
Abolish the antiquated "we're looking for any excuse to kill you" rules that rogue cops had to abide by. The "oh its about risk" rules that weren't really about risk, because logging in to spawn in the middle of a sweep, or getting killed by map geometry or a glitching prop, is not risk, it's outright stupidity.

3) Rebels can't kill you for being a Rogue Cop.
I don't care how much your character REALLY hates people on the same side as him. A rogue cop that is working with the rebels is an ally, whether you like that or not. You do not have a valid reason. Killing rogue cops is actively detrimental to your faction. You are reducing the number of rebels that exist in the world, with your justification being "well they were on the bad side originally," which is about as good a reason as "he was a murderer," which, spoilers, almost all rebels also are. I mean fucking hell, people were happily making drug trades and excuses with/for X-RAY, who was a fucking Jigsaw-esque serial killer who put pipe bombs and traps about the place and randomly murdering people.
But a ROGUE COP sets off the moral sensor for these characters.
Yeah right fuck off lol.

I agree with this.

Risk should be if you pissed off dudes in the past and you ended up being fucked by them when you went rogue

Not haha moral compass pk hungry

Rogue cops should have the same exact PK rules as any other character, because they are... a character. The only risk that should come from being rogue is having an OTA kill squad sent after you to absolutely make a show of force and force the rebels to hand you over unless they wanted to fight (reference when we got Sasha in City 8 and we had the OTA kill squad in our base, except PK risks were for every rebel there, or when we as CPs pulled up to the rebel base with an APC, fucked with their base and demanded they give us the guy with a garand), or crossing paths with people you have fucked with in the prison start or otherwise, by harassing them and stealing their shit in the small city.

It should not be PK hungry autism like we saw in City RP, the moment some cop goes rogue because they've found out their family is dead (fucking shocker i know) they go rogue because, well, their only reason to actually stay in the force is gone, they get capped by some normal anti-killing guy because HE WAS COP MUH MORAL COMPASSS

Finis had cops go rogue, but not to the level of there were no more cops lmao. Before it was cracked down we had... what.. 4-5 cops go rogue? And one was already a rogue, I had an actual reason of being tagged autonomous and a couple others

 

[Ond]

they get capped by some normal anti-killing guy because HE WAS COP MUH MORAL COMPASSS

killing cops in an hl2rp setting for this is perfectly valid by the way

i literally gutted and brutally murdered a 19 year old conscript cp without knowing he was conscripted because of this

 

[Rabid]

I mean, its no secret that rogues have traditionally been accepted or killed based on who they are OOC, which is why a lot of rogues who do go rogue ditch everything the second they can and already have "rebel gear" to swap into.

Losefa (great character no shade) worked two terms in CAB and everyone's reasoning for not shooting him head was "aye well he tried to make citizens lives better" but you had massive justifications as to why a random former UM worked got murdered because a rebel didn't personally know them despite them being vouched for by other rebels.

The real reason? It was Jimbo and he had OOC friends. That was it.

So yeah, the rogue system is flawed but that can't really be helped - and the problem with this:

Risk should be if you pissed off dudes in the past and you ended up being fucked by them when you went rogue

Not haha moral compass pk hungry

Is that all the cops currently serving, in-setting, are those that stuck around to keep fighting, knowing what might happen. Its not like the city. I know they're characters, but at the same time basically getting a void on all the shit you did as a cop and ignoring the context of the setting doesn't sit right with me.

Imagine the reverse. You have a rebel who defected to the cops (for the sake of argument) in the middle of a warzone. The cops know they've probably shot cops and killed their comrades - are they all expected to just be like "aye mate welcome to the force, haha :)"?

 

[Rabid]

Adding on to the above as I don't wanna add more to it:

Most rogue cops who've survived long term (thinking the likes of Flippy's rogue or even my rogue, not so much Helix on LP as he was an exception given the circumstances) didn't let on that they were cops until they'd more than earned the trust of the rebels so they knew they wouldn't get shot for revealing it.

Rogues need risk to their choice.

Removing the ability for rebels to kill them because they were too obvious or not tactful makes going rogue a much easier decision. Dodge one sweep on a map like this for a brand new risk-free character arc? That's really no choice at all. That's childs play for anyone with half a brain.

 

[MaXenzie]

Is that all the cops currently serving, in-setting, are those that stuck around to keep fighting, knowing what might happen. Its not like the city. I know they're characters, but at the same time basically getting a void on all the shit you did as a cop and ignoring the context of the setting doesn't sit right with me.

thats why this suggestion is here

4) Applying for Rogue Auths as a pre-existing cop is FAR HARDER.
The only cops that're still around post-collapse are the fanatics who genuinely, unironically believe in the combine. The guys who actually cared about loyalist points. The ones who wanted to be in CAB. There is zero justification otherwise. Why would you be part of the Combine now? You're the Nazis after Hitler killed himself. Only the absolute zealots remained. Everyone else dropped their guns and went home (or in this case, joined the winning side.)

brand new rogue cops should be very rare, because its antithetical to your character's inherent traits, since they're dumb enough to still be loyal to the combine up until now


but what about people making char auths for rogue cops who went rogue the day city 17 fell

 

[Rabid]

but what about people making char auths for rogue cops who went rogue the day city 17 fell

What, like as backstory? Why not? I know people will go "well that just lets them skip being a cop" but its not like they'd get any of the gear, because it'd destroy the point.

I think we both agree that secrecy (IC) is the best course of action either way. Giving someone auths to have some info on combine equipment and stuff sounds like a cool thing to me.

 

[Kafe]

brand new rogue cops should be very rare, because its antithetical to your character's inherent traits, since they're dumb enough to still be loyal to the combine up until now

I figure rogue auths would come in more when their place in the transhumanisation queue comes up.
for a cop if there was anytime to get cold feet and start running, it'd be when their own sense of life was on the line.

 

[sky]

Perhaps the rule can be written slightly different. The "any deaths after you have gone rogue" rule was meant for any deaths that either occur as a result of your rogue actions or while trying to escape from the consequences of such actions. For example, RLs investigating and killing the rogue unit for rogue actions, the rogue unit being killed by rebels after running away (despite being rogue), or the rogue unit falling from a cliff after having done something rogue (that could have led to them being investigated and killed regardless). If they escape, it's not quite clear when that PK risk would end, but they shouldn't be at risk forever.

To make it clear: there are currently no blanket "rogue unit" authorisations. Instead, the authorisations I've granted have been for performing certain rogue actions. For example, deliberate sabotage of APCs & generators, deliberate friendly fire in combat, but not as far as trying to deliberately PK RLs for them doing their job (MFW that still ended up happening anyway). Full turncoat rogue actions are also intentionally limited to only when the rogue unit is in a position where they would have no other choice but to run or die. On death, players get a new CP, keeping the whitelist. This system has worked fine so far.

1) You can become a Rogue Cop via Char Auths, not needing the whitelist.

A completely rogue unit from the outset is going to be the exception rather than a documented rule. Their actions are inevitably going to cause a huge headache at some point in their existence, and letting rebel players legitimately infiltrate the faction has the potential to massively upset balance. Any such authorisation will have to come with a lot of strings attached, assuming they get accepted.

Any character authorisation for this should come with an accompanying application (if the player does not already hold the whitelist). Otherwise, it would be obvious if someone gets added to the roster without an application.

A character authorisation for a CP that went rogue prior is out of my hands (as they are now just a rebel with a CP background), and I'm sure people could apply for that already.

4) Applying for Rogue Auths as a pre-existing cop is FAR HARDER.

It already comes with restrictions, and few enough have applied. There is no point to this.

You're the Nazis after Hitler killed himself. Only the absolute zealots remained.

We are not in a post-Hitler scenario. This is more like a post-Stalingrad scenario. The Combine is still very much intact across the world and is extremely dangerous; their main issue is that they are cut off from the Overworld, which prevents any overwhelming force from reasserting control. Many cities still have operational Citadels, and many of these incoming CPs are reinforcements from said cities. The writing is not quite on the wall for many who side with the Combine—at least for the time being.

 

[john]

so the faction doesn't hemorage cops, exactly the way it did during the Finus event. That killed the event dead in the same way it'd kill the server.

no it didnt there were more union than rebels the entire event

 

[MaXenzie]

never got the "allowing cops to go rogue would kill the CP faction" argument

it doesn't blacklist the rogue cop from making a new CP character

they don't get dewhitelisted

they don't permanently occupy a slot in the roster with their now-rebel cop

the amount of CPs remains the same, because they'd make a new CP character
you just get 1 more rebel

 

[john]

also isnt this event a war with a dynamic outcome if the whole union defects isnt that just part of the story
feed them more non uu beans. start conscripting civvies, get desperate and deploy experimental synths
play into it if the cops hemorrhage people this is a cooperative writing server