hl2rp² feedback thread 2.0²

[shad]

merge the cops and resistance together and pit them against a greater foe so that the server is no longer built on an antagonistic dichotomy and we can focus on cooperative storytelling against an enemy that is predominantly played by staff.

this is based

make race x, xenians, synths, w/e the big bad

divert from NORMS

halo 3 plotline lookin ahh

 

[Candle]

this is based

make race x, xenians, synths, w/e the big bad

divert from NORMS

halo 3 plotline lookin ahh

i genuinely think an overarching plot regarding 'the wider combine has abandoned earth, no more slugs, complete shutoff, synths disconnected,' with invasive alien species (race x, xen) slowly encroaching and cutting off major spots of the earth like some kind of infection, (the americas are an overrun wasteland of biological opposites- the lush flora and fauna of xen out-competing the native plants, would be incredibly based

city forty-five is a pox on europe, slowly spreading out through major transit lines which used to connect the old-world (train tunnels, highways, old-world infrastructure) like fucked up, diseased veins spreading disease and biological maluses- race-x is outcompeting even local antlion nests, just complete and utter ecoterrorism on a planetary scale

all that's left are humans, and transhumans, the very forces the combine managed to turn on eachother before getting cut off- having to either learn to fight together, or get collectively overrun by a species capitalizing on humanities' infighting

i love to remember that one of the combines' biggest strengths were, after establishing a presence on earth, using the earth's very own inhabitants to strike a war between the species itself. likely no members of the combine (aside from synths and a very few select soldiers deployed during the seven-hour-war,) actually died while establishing earth as a colony. an overwhelming majority of deaths fighting for and against the combine were all human. they established their own status quo, and left.

imagining this turning into something bigger- the last remnants of humanity being forced to band together to save the rock they're all stuck on, shifting away from x vs y vs z, into xy vs z, would be huge. and there'd still be plenty of room for infighting, because if you put everyone in a room together, one of them is gonna wanna kill the other, and it'd be up to the sound minds to prevent the dumbasses from dooming the species

 

[STUCK IN A CAKE]

If you put your heart and soul into a character, you should be the one to decide when they die, plain & simple.

It sucks to have an unsatisfying end to your character, and nobody deserves it - in fact, it can drive some people away from the server.

I was trying to give HUNTER-3 a sendoff and some admin couldn't help but try and Cat-in-the-hat smash a Phase 1 in the back of the head with a shovel.

 

[Blitz0012]

I know we're very late into the conversation by now and past this, but it seems like conversation has died down again and this was actually an idea that on the surface had a lot of promise, but I feel theres very notable issues that aren't brought up enough and it seems like a good time to try and discuss them. Mainly because I'd like more conversation or at least deconstructing my ideas as to why it would not work may end up revealing something useful.

Spoiler: A lot of text

The main problem in my eyes is that its entirely detached from what the intention with Civil Protection is. A dehumanised paramilitary force meant to be as unwelcoming as possible and detach collaborators who join it from the people they oppress(ed). Seeing how this REALLY did not change in the slightest in structure, appearance/aesthetic, equipment or even initially purpose with their first endeavour on the server being a return to their traditional role of policing a refugee camp, it did not sell any sort of post-occupation change whatsoever beyond the cults that have died out by now and I feel like its a fatal misstep that'd be very hard to go back on now with all the groundwork laid down and Civil Protection already being established as quite inflexable regardless of setting changes throughout the iteration, never once making any particularly fundamental changes up until very recently where you could consider divisions as one, albeit without serving the goal of pointing the faction in any particularly new direction outside of organisation and XRAYs more roleplay friendly nature in particular.

I know a cooperative roleplaying experience would be better, and this is an attempt to put the two forces together without effectively cutting one half of the server out of the storyline, but like, how do you make that happen in a way that makes in universe sense? Its opposed to the Combines oppressive nature and I doubt any work beyond maybe giving cops spray painted uniforms would be put in to reasonably combine the twos aesthetic to make something new rather than just having the two operate in tandem as a sort of coalition with some very major contrast that comes with it.

And what enemy takes over to oppose the two? all nonhuman Combine forces? Nothing new, and it'd probably rightly annoy some people holding the OTA whitelist at this moment to be reduced to a pseudo-NPC event faction. Race X or Xen? An alien enemy of their kind risks becoming kind of boring and lacking any interesting motives or interactions that dont play on their animalistic tendencies, being even more limited in potential interactions than the Combine as is.

A third party human faction? Okay, how do we go about characterising them, giving them a unique identity, motive and appearance and generally make them actually interesting in a way that preferably plays to HL2s almost apocalyptic sci fi world and elements in it instead of just slavers or mercs working for whatever johnny bad guy wants to take over and do X thing before we inevitably beat them? The Emergent Society felt like the best attempt at a 'third party faction' with its own identity, purpose and culture, but never one that felt like it could be a force to oppose both of the other factions, let alone when they're working together for a mutual goal.

And on that, what would the overarching goal even be for the two factions that could possibly unite them and refocus the servers storyline without any inconsolable issues between the two beyond the 'CPs gets betrayed out of nowhere, fuck you' possibility? It's a lot, too much to possibly pull off this late into the server if I had to say.

I'm sorry if this all seems out of left field or maybe aggressive at some points, but I'd actually, genuinely like to dissect this idea for once. Because it does hold quite a bit of promise and also conveniently allows me to bring up some of the inherent flaws in Civil Protection in a post-occupation setting. Also sorry if this doesn't entirely hold up, I'm very tired rn and my insight into current server affairs is very limited. I'm moreso hoping something will change to reel me back in because as of now I don't feel like getting back into Civil Protection and the less structured albeit more free rebel stuff doesn't appeal to me.

Good night.

I'm not sure where exactly it fits into this idea but I really wanted to see a much more disorganised Combine force.

 

[Trains]

combine shouldve been an event faction cough

 

[MaXenzie]

I know we're very late into the conversation by now and past this, but it seems like conversation has died down again and this was actually an idea that on the surface had a lot of promise, but I feel theres very notable issues that aren't brought up enough and it seems like a good time to try and discuss them. Mainly because I'd like more conversation or at least deconstructing my ideas as to why it would not work may end up revealing something useful.

Spoiler: A lot of text

The main problem in my eyes is that its entirely detached from what the intention with Civil Protection is. A dehumanised paramilitary force meant to be as unwelcoming as possible and detach collaborators who join it from the people they oppress(ed). Seeing how this REALLY did not change in the slightest in structure, appearance/aesthetic, equipment or even initially purpose with their first endeavour on the server being a return to their traditional role of policing a refugee camp, it did not sell any sort of post-occupation change whatsoever beyond the cults that have died out by now and I feel like its a fatal misstep that'd be very hard to go back on now with all the groundwork laid down and Civil Protection already being established as quite inflexable regardless of setting changes throughout the iteration, never once making any particularly fundamental changes up until very recently where you could consider divisions as one, albeit without serving the goal of pointing the faction in any particularly new direction outside of organisation and XRAYs more roleplay friendly nature in particular.

I know a cooperative roleplaying experience would be better, and this is an attempt to put the two forces together without effectively cutting one half of the server out of the storyline, but like, how do you make that happen in a way that makes in universe sense? Its opposed to the Combines oppressive nature and I doubt any work beyond maybe giving cops spray painted uniforms would be put in to reasonably combine the twos aesthetic to make something new rather than just having the two operate in tandem as a sort of coalition with some very major contrast that comes with it.

And what enemy takes over to oppose the two? all nonhuman Combine forces? Nothing new, and it'd probably rightly annoy some people holding the OTA whitelist at this moment to be reduced to a pseudo-NPC event faction. Race X or Xen? An alien enemy of their kind risks becoming kind of boring and lacking any interesting motives or interactions that dont play on their animalistic tendencies, being even more limited in potential interactions than the Combine as is.

A third party human faction? Okay, how do we go about characterising them, giving them a unique identity, motive and appearance and generally make them actually interesting in a way that preferably plays to HL2s almost apocalyptic sci fi world and elements in it instead of just slavers or mercs working for whatever johnny bad guy wants to take over and do X thing before we inevitably beat them? The Emergent Society felt like the best attempt at a 'third party faction' with its own identity, purpose and culture, but never one that felt like it could be a force to oppose both of the other factions, let alone when they're working together for a mutual goal.

And on that, what would the overarching goal even be for the two factions that could possibly unite them and refocus the servers storyline without any inconsolable issues between the two beyond the 'CPs gets betrayed out of nowhere, fuck you' possibility? It's a lot, too much to possibly pull off this late into the server if I had to say.

I'm sorry if this all seems out of left field or maybe aggressive at some points, but I'd actually, genuinely like to dissect this idea for once. Because it does hold quite a bit of promise and also conveniently allows me to bring up some of the inherent flaws in Civil Protection in a post-occupation setting. Also sorry if this doesn't entirely hold up, I'm very tired rn and my insight into current server affairs is very limited. I'm moreso hoping something will change to reel me back in because as of now I don't feel like getting back into Civil Protection and the less structured albeit more free rebel stuff doesn't appeal to me.

Good night.

yeah but i think my idea would work

 

[Thood74]

i genuinely think an overarching plot regarding 'the wider combine has abandoned earth, no more slugs, complete shutoff, synths disconnected,' with invasive alien species (race x, xen) slowly encroaching and cutting off major spots of the earth like some kind of infection, (the americas are an overrun wasteland of biological opposites- the lush flora and fauna of xen out-competing the native plants, would be incredibly based

city forty-five is a pox on europe, slowly spreading out through major transit lines which used to connect the old-world (train tunnels, highways, old-world infrastructure) like fucked up, diseased veins spreading disease and biological maluses- race-x is outcompeting even local antlion nests, just complete and utter ecoterrorism on a planetary scale

all that's left are humans, and transhumans, the very forces the combine managed to turn on eachother before getting cut off- having to either learn to fight together, or get collectively overrun by a species capitalizing on humanities' infighting

i love to remember that one of the combines' biggest strengths were, after establishing a presence on earth, using the earth's very own inhabitants to strike a war between the species itself. likely no members of the combine (aside from synths and a very few select soldiers deployed during the seven-hour-war,) actually died while establishing earth as a colony. an overwhelming majority of deaths fighting for and against the combine were all human. they established their own status quo, and left.

imagining this turning into something bigger- the last remnants of humanity being forced to band together to save the rock they're all stuck on, shifting away from x vs y vs z, into xy vs z, would be huge. and there'd still be plenty of room for infighting, because if you put everyone in a room together, one of them is gonna wanna kill the other, and it'd be up to the sound minds to prevent the dumbasses from dooming the species

I like this conceptually, but I still believe that Xen or Race X or any other world cancer would not make for an interesting enemy in the slightest. They’re effectively just a bunch of alien castes slapdashed together by whatever psychic creature is strong enough to keep them working as a team, assuming they even have any entity commanding them and they aren’t just behaving like animals. Very limited room for any interaction there that isn’t fighting.

An enemy like that would probably only be good as a backdrop for something else, and while thats fine if you’d want to focus on something insular to whatever Combine/Rebel hybrid takes over, I figure theres got to be some better option.

 

[Generally Fruity]

I like this conceptually, but I still believe that Xen or Race X or any other world cancer would not make for an interesting enemy in the slightest. They’re effectively just a bunch of alien castes slapdashed together by whatever psychic creature is strong enough to keep them working as a team, assuming they even have any entity commanding them and they aren’t just behaving like animals. Very limited room for any interaction there that isn’t fighting.

An enemy like that would probably only be good as a backdrop for something else, and while thats fine if you’d want to focus on something insular to whatever Combine/Rebel hybrid takes over, I figure theres got to be some better option.

why you keep going "x is good idea but it's boring and i don't like it..."
we get it, you have very high standards and everything needs very strong treatment before you're willing to play

combine shouldve been an event faction cough

everything above metrocop at the very least. regular players shouldn't be put in meta-IC "vanguard" roles (cough EOW) that are intentionally void of RP/characterization.

 

[Eviction Notice]

i genuinely think an overarching plot regarding 'the wider combine has abandoned earth, no more slugs, complete shutoff, synths disconnected,' with invasive alien species (race x, xen) slowly encroaching and cutting off major spots of the earth like some kind of infection, (the americas are an overrun wasteland of biological opposites- the lush flora and fauna of xen out-competing the native plants, would be incredibly based

I genuinely thought this was where we were heading so I did a whole 'guy keeps predicting the future' arc for my character and then it just didn't happen and now he looks like a twit.

 

[Numbers]

brandon is the same dude that led to the epic combine ball moment where the security council got to quash a cop rebellion because he had the proactivity to initiate that situation in the first place

brandon is also the same dude that did a lot of in base roleplay with prisoners (vortigaunt & human) regarding their IC processing, and giving them activities like grub harvests while they were captured back in asheville

i mean genuinely speaking, what is so different between brandon and the average minmaxing rebel RPer that wants to win everything (and still got to lead/influence cells) - both of them "destroy roleplay" in their own way if we want to be super critical about every person we appoint


also lol don't @ me about "needing a break for 6 months" - you try getting a good grade at my rancid professor gambling university, frankly pathetic that people want to judge me for how I spend six months of my life out of a year. I have tried finding a replacement for myself, nobody steps up for it and the ones that do are seen as unfit for the role

 

[deathwolf]

anyone who complains about numbers inactivity is a chud, maybe a co-SD might help but there’s no universe where it’d be acceptable to put Neb over Uni

 

[Trains]

brandon is the same dude that led to the epic combine ball moment where the security council got to quash a cop rebellion because he had the proactivity to initiate that situation in the first place

brandon is also the same dude that did a lot of in base roleplay with prisoners (vortigaunt & human) regarding their IC processing, and giving them activities like grub harvests while they were captured back in asheville

i mean genuinely speaking, what is so different between brandon and the average minmaxing rebel RPer that wants to win everything (and still got to lead/influence cells) - both of them "destroy roleplay" in their own way if we want to be super critical about every person we appoint


also lol don't @ me about "needing a break for 6 months" - you try getting a good grade at my rancid professor gambling university, frankly pathetic that people want to judge me for how I spend six months of my life out of a year. I have tried finding a replacement for myself, nobody steps up for it and the ones that do are seen as unfit for the role

fuck you numbers you should know better than to prioritise your real life over your Garry’s mod server director role

 

[Generally Fruity]

When People say "the server" they usually mean "my enjoyment".... wtf, you have abandoned my enjoyment for education..

 

[deathwolf]

i mean genuinely speaking, what is so different between brandon and the average minmaxing rebel RPer that wants to win everything (and still got to lead/influence cells) - both of them "destroy roleplay" in their own way if we want to be super critical about every person we appoint

surely he… doesn’t mean me right guys?

 

[Simman102]

do events for cops maybe

but why dont you do events for cops

Try logging on your staff character and go ham, try reaching out with other GMs and do something with the event server for cops.

I don't really agree with the sentiment of trying to somehow shame or pressure event staff to put effort into something they have no motivation or creativity to do. If they have a preference let them be; trying to force the opposite is bound to end with either a lackluster experience for both sides or straight up burnout.

I only wish that the hypocrisy of holding the same expectations towards the both sides was cut out; I've seen the polarity first-hand and they effectively play on a different server so it's not surprising at all that their attitidues and approaches will reflect that.

 

[rob]

Is it possible for staff to reduce the intensity of the snowfall on the map? I like snow, but a constant blizzard is a bit much.

 

[Trains]

Is it possible for staff to reduce the intensity of the snowfall on the map? I like snow, but a constant blizzard is a bit much.

It’s out of our hands. The blizzard decides when it is time. All you can do is pray of the snow’s demise.

 

[Candle]

I like this conceptually, but I still believe that Xen or Race X or any other world cancer would not make for an interesting enemy in the slightest. They’re effectively just a bunch of alien castes slapdashed together by whatever psychic creature is strong enough to keep them working as a team, assuming they even have any entity commanding them and they aren’t just behaving like animals. Very limited room for any interaction there that isn’t fighting.

An enemy like that would probably only be good as a backdrop for something else, and while thats fine if you’d want to focus on something insular to whatever Combine/Rebel hybrid takes over, I figure theres got to be some better option.

nihilanth 2

 

['77 East]

i mean genuinely speaking, what is so different between brandon and the average minmaxing rebel RPer that wants to win everything (and still got to lead/influence cells) - both of them "destroy roleplay" in their own way if we want to be super critical about every person we appoint

the average 'minmaxxer' isn't leading an entire faction that was designed to encourage roleplay in characters that previously existed exclusively as server PK tools, a faction that has oversight, authority and punishment over rank and file cops in virtually most circumstances of late, and unlike with an rank leader you just can't talk back to a commander.

that average 'minmaxxer' has probably four people, maybe six to eight, and if they tried to pull rank on the insurgency would likely be shot dead by someone else for trying to imitate harry. the transhuman arm has over twenty nine people and jurisdiction over itself and in less-than-unique circumstances, cops, and is a concrete hierarchy. you cannot argue with your superior as a brainjacked slab of steroid meat.

lastly, 'minmaxxer' insurgents aren't appointed at all, but they can definitely be affected by staff or others - just look at the mayhem that went down on the first month of the server's opening and pretty much all of it was entirely player driven; an OOC lead has no mandate to deliver and no rebuff when it comes to player consequence.

brandon is the same dude that -

brandon is also the same dude that -

that's great, you really want me to start going down the hole of people who 'did that' with things and were absolutely heinous when they weren't doing 'that thing' - or all the other times they were off hiding behind doing 'that thing' as some shield for criticism?

pumpkin created roleplay, encouraged political intrigue and did some charity work on a character, but that's not why he's remembered. he also walked around with a gestapo uniform, abused weapon scripts to itemtransfer and harassed people to keep his pristine image. I don't need to regurgitate the faults of prior leads here but c'mon, you know that we had a gigantic 22 page thread about exactly why the mentalities that are on display weren't acceptable and that's been brushed off here and now just because he...

... made a bad choice during a situation leading to his entire squad getting wiped, while raging in VOIP.
... then went on a bender complaining about the very situation he instigated being pre-empted by the council to begin with.
... then tried flashing around sniper footage looking for people to bait?

things that were discussed on that very thread as examples unbecoming of those leading the civil protectorate?

that situation is a clear example of why we direly need characterization as a focus for faction matters and not TDM of the week bullshit where the losing side screams ragebait and the winner flaunts killcam montages in their private channel.

if he can prioritize that, fine - let me say no more, but pretending it didn't happen is absurd.

also lol don't @ me about "needing a break for 6 months" - you try getting a good grade at my rancid professor gambling university, frankly pathetic that people want to judge me for how I spend six months of my life out of a year.

fuck you numbers you should know better than to prioritise your real life over your Garry’s mod server director role

anyone who complains about numbers inactivity is a chud, maybe a co-SD might help but there’s no universe where it’d be acceptable to put Neb over Uni

When People say "the server" they usually mean "my enjoyment".... wtf

nice to see another bunch of strawmen in the wild, guys.

@Blackquill had Ronald, he should seriously think about focusing on his life and getting someone to co-SD alongside him.

yeah, I clearly asked for numbers to drop out of university and squander his life. fucking outstanding commentary you lot.

EVERY SD has taken monumental breaks during their leadership because the whole server dynamic hinges on them, because the position wears people thin. that's obvious - yet NO ONE HAS COMPENSATED FOR IT AND STILL HASN'T. @Rabid, Quill, Linnitrix, and now you - and that isn't a bad thing on it's own, people have real life to attend to - you, me, even @Generally Fruity when he's not off luring crackheads into listening to his psychedelic event pitches.

but it is a problem when nothing's been done to alleviate staff standing around with their metaphorical hands in their pockets, waiting for shit to happen because the SD is the server arbiter, less staff equal more responsibility on fewer shoulders and all the non-leads suddenly have to divvy up every responsibility that's not outright assigned, especially when other staff members just vanish.

for fuck's sake I had people complaining to me yesterday that with @Ron now gone there were less people to pull slack and uncertainty about who was taking over what functions especially because more staff were assumed DOA, and I'm no stranger to that, I staffed on Stasiland when Shrike dipped and @Merlinsclaw was left wondering tf was happening with everything for a solid week while the stasi ran around screaming about paper scripts vanishing and the insurgency database going blank twice - and you were also there for that.

an education is a good thing to have. seriously, especially with the current state of living careening off a cliff in most places, but please remember that this dynamic is inherently problematic - if you do not balance this load somehow, this place doesn't function.

if it has to be one or the other, give this open-ended server an ending - like was originally intended, if someone wants to bother digging that far back - before ever thinking about giving it more time you can't spare, and shouldn't.

I have tried finding a replacement for myself, nobody steps up for it and the ones that do are seen as unfit for the role

where in any of my posts did I say replacement SD?

co-SD. literally just someone to pick up slack where it can be done.

if that's untenable, why can't functions be handed off to SA's to lessen the cycle of red tape leading back to you? this is the same stuff that plagued previous iterations with everything resting on the hands of Quill and Linnitrix 24/7 because no one wanted to place any modicum of trust on the team that were supposed to be doing things.

are they or are they not staff members?
why are we still dealing with this fault years after people made that link?
why do we even have SA's if we're still doing this?

 

[deathwolf]

if it has to be one or the other, give this open-ended server an ending - like was originally intended, if someone wants to bother digging that far back - before ever thinking about giving it more time you can't spare, and shouldn't.

I don't think it should end yet